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Post by chrisb on Feb 14, 2020 6:39:46 GMT
you know I really hope Renault come good this year and surprise a few folk,
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Post by René on Feb 14, 2020 15:27:49 GMT
you know I really hope Renault come good this year and surprise a few folk, Me too Chris, I always liked the Régie. It would be great if they could fight for fourth with McLaren and maybe the odd podium now and then. It will be interesting to see how Ocon will hold up against Ricciardo. That will tell us how good he really is.
And Daniel deserves some success, just imagine him on the podium again! He's such a nice bloke, did you see him on The Daily Show?
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Post by René on Feb 14, 2020 15:30:42 GMT
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Post by René on Feb 14, 2020 15:34:36 GMT
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Post by Carl on Feb 14, 2020 17:10:43 GMT
Good to see Alfa-Romeo bodywork returned to it's proud serpent heritage and wonder if the man being swallowed is meant to be Toto Wolff
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Post by mikael on Feb 15, 2020 8:29:12 GMT
Comparing the photos of the different cars presented so far, it seems that there are some rather large differences in the design of the barge boards, turning vanes, and winglets at the leading part of the sidepods. Those of the Mercedes seem to be the most complicated ones, by far. In comparison, the Ferrari appears surprisingly "minimalistic" and "clean". (But of course, the mat black painting can play a trick on the observer.) It will be interesting to see some testing lap times.
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Post by chrisb on Feb 15, 2020 9:05:43 GMT
cheers Rene, I had never heard of this programme in truth, but what kinda shocks me is just how far F1 became 'forgotten' in the USA, not really harping on about yesterday being better or worse, but with Jimmy on the front cover of Time and Jackie being so well known out there it really does seem we walked an awful long way backwards, but on the brighter side, always look on the bright side someone said, what a fantastic ambassador Daniel is, and a terrific bloke and a damm good driver, it would be fantastic to see him on the top podium again, and yes how well will Ocon do agin him I wonder and where is the Hulk?
Mikael, do you think - a bit like Ducati, Ferrari are not showing all their cards at this moment, just to make sure no one copies them?
That Alfa sign, just magical isn't it?
but the Merc looks a bit too purposful, but without Niki will they be rudderless?
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Post by René on Feb 15, 2020 10:47:06 GMT
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Post by René on Feb 15, 2020 10:51:20 GMT
Comparing the photos of the different cars presented so far, it seems that there are some rather large differences in the design of the barge boards, turning vanes, and winglets at the leading part of the sidepods. Those of the Mercedes seem to be the most complicated ones, by far. In comparison, the Ferrari appears surprisingly "minimalistic" and "clean". (But of course, the mat black painting can play a trick on the observer.) It will be interesting to see some testing lap times. Well spotted Mikael. But as Chris said, they are probably not showing everything yet. These launches are PR/sponsor events which give an impression of the new car. I am sure we will see more next week which will be very interesting indeed. Can't wait! |
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Post by René on Feb 17, 2020 16:28:07 GMT
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Post by Carl on Feb 17, 2020 17:12:39 GMT
I still maintain that the similarities are more striking than any essential differences in design. When compared to Grand Prix cars of other eras, today's independent designs look like slight variations on a basic specification. It may be subversive to suggest that aerodynamicists all rely in large part on the same CAD software, but iconoclast is my middle name. 
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Post by René on Feb 17, 2020 23:16:33 GMT
I still maintain that the similarities are more striking than any essential differences in design. When compared to Grand Prix cars of other eras, today's independent designs look like slight variations on a basic specification. It may be subversive to suggest that aerodynamicists all rely in large part on the same CAD software, but iconoclast is my middle name. Agreed Carl, the cars do look very similar. But, to play the devil's advocate, in a way this has always been the case. Looking at these 1970 cars, the overall layout of each car is the same. It is only the Lotus 72 which is really different with the low wedge nose and the radiators moved to the sides, a trend swiftly followed by the others.  And these 1988 cars are basically also quite similar.  It is mainly the mid seventies where we see more variation when the awareness of aerodynamic possibilities was growing but knowledge was still limited. The imagination of the designer was leading.  Now it's all windtunnels and computers that give the same output so the difference is in the detail. But still, they are not identical.  |
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Post by Carl on Feb 18, 2020 4:17:46 GMT
Rene, Your in-depth analysis goes to the heart of how, when and why similarity and variation occur. Well done! You and Mikael and John Charles are our resident experts.  -Carl |
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Post by René on Feb 18, 2020 12:26:22 GMT
Rene, Your in-depth analysis goes to the heart of how, when and why similarity and variation occur. Well done! You and Mikael and John Charles are our resident experts. -Carl Carl, that's way too much credit! Mikael's technical knowledge is on another planet and JC is like a walking racing encyclopedia! But thanks anyway.  Reality is of course that the rule book is thicker and more strict than it has ever been before, an almost inevitable pitfall for a technical sport.
The best times were indeed the seventies when there was still so much to discover and the rule book was thin.
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Post by mikael on Feb 19, 2020 10:23:07 GMT
René and Carl , you're being way too generous; but thank you kindly. Some really interesting thoughts, René, and excellent illustrations. I cannot really get rid of the thought, though, that more freedom with respect to the layout of the engine would have made things a good deal more interesting, because here it might not be possible to say/determine what is optimal. If the V-6 layout hadn't been specified, Ferrari might have chosen that layout anyway. But I imagine that other manufacturers, particularly Honda, might have chosen something different; maybe a V-4 or even a "V-5" layout (a 3+2 layout, as used also by VW at some time). And like in MotoGP, others might have chosen an in-line 4 layout. This might even be the best solution for F1, as it would allow for the compact "packing" that apparently is so desirable. If this had been so there could perhaps even have been a "trade-off competition": better aerodynamic performance vs better engine performance ... A great pity indeed that F1's engine layout had to be specified to be V-6 only. Honda's V-5 MotoGP engine from 2001.    (Photos borrowed from: advrider.com/f/threads/rtw-with-noah-on-a-ktm-690.781893/page-131) Yamaha in-line 4 MotoGP engine (2006) |
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