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Post by Jamie on Sept 18, 2018 15:27:54 GMT
I think you may have missed Rob's nuance there Jamie . Ha ha the internet kills subtle nuance doesn’t it 😆 I know what Rob was getting though and I meant that even the forum Gods can’t change Lewis’ March to the title.....even voodoo can’t stop him!
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Post by Jamie on Sept 18, 2018 15:34:07 GMT
I think our discussion here shows that Lewis certainly sparks debate 😆 I do think that the poster on MS had it about right....he does get closer scrutiny than others I think and some of it unfair. And some of the things he says rankle, I can completely see that, but quite a lot of his peers are the same and don’t get the same treatment. I can see the counter argument though and he sometimes doesn’t do himself any favours with the way he comes across. He’s marmite alright but I think we’d all 100% agree that he’s a brilliant racing driver. Is he the best driver of this era? In my opinion a resounding yes and he’d certainly have a seat at the top table of our sports greats. Obviously this is all just my personal opinion.....happy to be shot down etc 😁 You're right Jamie. Never a dull moment when discussing Lewis! I do agree he often gets closer scrutiny than others which is mostly unfair. But with sports it's not only about who is the best, it is just as much about emotions, passion and personal preferences. Personally, I don't give a d**** about Lewis's private life, his hairstyle or jewelry. I once witnessed him upclose at a Mercedes event in my hometown a few years back and he came across as a truly descent fellow, can't say anything else. He can come across as a bit forced sometimes but hey, if he ever chose to wear red I would welcome him! I remember I 'hated' Senna back in the days, he ruined so many sunday afternoons for me! But besides being a Ferrari fan I am also a racing fan. I love the sport and fully acknowledged Senna's qualities and would have been euphoric had he ever signed a Ferrari contract. It's the same with Lewis for me. I wonder if he will ever drive for Ferrari? I also wonder if the Tifosi would fully embrace him, he seems to be hated by them at the moment. I’m sure that would change to adoration if he ever puts on the red overalls I suppose...
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Post by René on Sept 18, 2018 15:41:40 GMT
You're right Jamie. Never a dull moment when discussing Lewis! I do agree he often gets closer scrutiny than others which is mostly unfair. But with sports it's not only about who is the best, it is just as much about emotions, passion and personal preferences. Personally, I don't give a d**** about Lewis's private life, his hairstyle or jewelry. I once witnessed him upclose at a Mercedes event in my hometown a few years back and he came across as a truly descent fellow, can't say anything else. He can come across as a bit forced sometimes but hey, if he ever chose to wear red I would welcome him! I remember I 'hated' Senna back in the days, he ruined so many sunday afternoons for me! But besides being a Ferrari fan I am also a racing fan. I love the sport and fully acknowledged Senna's qualities and would have been euphoric had he ever signed a Ferrari contract. It's the same with Lewis for me. I wonder if he will ever drive for Ferrari? I also wonder if the Tifosi would fully embrace him, he seems to be hated by them at the moment. I’m sure that would change to adoration if he ever puts on the red overalls I suppose... I am sure the tifosi's feelings would turn around overnight. I remember when at Monza in the late 80's/early 90's, the tifosi hated Senna. But they would have adored him had he switched to Maranello like they did with Prost. When Alain won in Monza 1989 in a McLaren, the tifosi cheered for him because he just signed a Ferrari contract! All Ferrari fans are opportunists! I believe Lewis was actually disappointed when Vettel signed another 3 year deal. That closed the door for him. After McLaren and Mercedes, there is only one place left to go for him, isn't there?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2018 3:48:37 GMT
Haven't read the previous posts, only captured Jamie's comment about the Tifosi's attitude towards Hamilton. I think they respect him and know very well where he stands with respect to Vettel. They support their own team, but I don't think they are blind. Then, you know, the boos at Monza etc, it's all part of the show. Most of them would change the incumbent with Lewis in a heartbeat.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2018 3:51:41 GMT
Only to add that compiling the parallel between Rosberg and Hamilton got me thinking a bit.
While it is clear who is coming on top - not by much it may seem, but these days of high techno/high reliability that is all that is needed to make the difference between aces and the very good – it has increased my consideration of Rosberg. I thought and wrote at the time that he fully deserved his title and found the belittling on the British press unfair. Personally, I did overlook Nico in general - because I don’t follow it that closely, not an excuse, it is what it is for me. Now I would say his record stands up remarkably well against someone who is proving to be one of the all-time greats. Further, it has been claimed (by Mark Hughes, most likely) that ceteris paribus Vettel is about two hundredths [EDIT: or two tenths??] slower than Hamilton, which leads me to think that had Nico been in Vettel shoes, he most likely would have achieved pretty much the same (perhaps even better, because he appeared a more rounded, complete driver). Nico’s, and now Vettel’s, main issue has been to share their time with someone whose level is beyond the very good – I would say at Stewart’s level. Having Nico battled Hamilton on equal machinery, and not come out of it “destroyed”, quite the contrary with lot of credit, I would venture to say there is argument Nico is perhaps at least on par with Vettel. Vettel has the remaining of this season and next to prove me wrong.
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Post by robmarsh on Sept 19, 2018 5:02:27 GMT
Haven't read the previous posts, only captured Jamie's comment about the Tifosi's attitude towards Hamilton. I think they respect him and know very well where he stands with respect to Vettel. They support their own team, but I don't think they are blind. Then, you know, the boos at Monza etc, it's all part of the show. Most of them would change the incumbent with Lewis in a heartbeat. I think you are right all of you who said the tifosi would support Hamilton in a Ferrari. There is a picture of a pale, unshaven Prost, supported by two large bodyguards, taken during the race weekend at Monza in 1983. The crowd were quite rabid in their dislike for the man who could possibly take the championship away from Ferrari, yet fast forward to six years later and they were cheering him to the heavens because he would be driving for the Scuderia the following year. Like René I wouldn't mind Hamilton in a Ferrari and like others have said the true Hamilton, away from all the razzmatazz and showbiz is probably a really nice petrol head like the rest of us. I have seen videos of him talking to young karters and in unguarded moments comes across as a really good and pleasant guy. When Lewis finally stops racing I hope a really decent biographer writes a story on his motor racing career. I for one, will read it.
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Post by Carl on Sept 19, 2018 5:15:08 GMT
I want a master of fiction to write my biography.
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Post by Jamie on Sept 19, 2018 6:29:34 GMT
As you’ve said chaps, of course the Tifosi would adore Hamilton.....their dislike of him seemed quite intense at Monza this year but it’s been plenty worse for other drivers previously (a la Prost).
Don’t know why I said it really? I’m sure the Tifosi would cheer the dark lord himself if he did the business in a Ferrari F1 car 😁 it’s to their credit that it’s only Ferrari the team that really matters.
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Post by Jamie on Sept 19, 2018 6:35:01 GMT
Only to add that compiling the parallel between Rosberg and Hamilton got me thinking a bit. While it is clear who is coming on top - not by much it may seem, but these days of high techno/high reliability that is all that is needed to make the difference between aces and the very good – it has increased my consideration of Rosberg. I thought and wrote at the time that he fully deserved his title and found the belittling on the British press unfair. Personally, I did overlook Nico in general - because I don’t follow it that closely, not an excuse, it is what it is for me. Now I would say his record stands up remarkably well against someone who is proving to be one of the all-time greats. Further, it has been claimed (by Mark Hughes, most likely) that ceteris paribus Vettel is about two hundredths [EDIT: or two tenths??] slower than Hamilton, which leads me to think that had Nico been in Vettel shoes, he most likely would have achieved pretty much the same (perhaps even better, because he appeared a more rounded, complete driver). Nico’s, and now Vettel’s, main issue has been to share their time with someone whose level is beyond the very good – I would say at Stewart’s level. Having Nico battled Hamilton on equal machinery, and not come out of it “destroyed”, quite the contrary with lot of credit, I would venture to say there is argument Nico is perhaps at least on par with Vettel. Vettel has the remaining of this season and next to prove me wrong. I have the same view Lucio, I think Rosberg was really very good indeed if ultimately a tad behind Lewis. A weight seemed to lift from him as soon as the championship was his and he retired a happy man who’d achieved his goal and didn’t give a damn about the naysayers - classy.
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Post by René on Sept 19, 2018 7:44:15 GMT
Haven't read the previous posts... You really should Lucio. Helps to avoid misunderstanding and repitition. But otherwise I agree with your analysis re. Rosberg. Much underrated when he was still active but a mighty fine driver he was.
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Post by René on Sept 19, 2018 7:46:39 GMT
I want a master of fiction to write my biography. Isn't Sean Spicer out of a job currently?
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Post by chrisb on Sept 19, 2018 9:53:46 GMT
going back to the WDC's I didn't care for, just joking...but then I have never voted for Marquez - but he is odd's on to be the champion - not that I disrespect him, quite honestly he is incredible but I would like to see him beaten - so I vote elsewhere - and with Aragon coming up, a really great circuit I am hoping for a bit of luck for Yamaha, which is the same as F1, I haven't voted for Lewis - not that I disrespect him, simply I want to see a different winner, like the Hulk.. more in hope than in reality but semi-seriously Lewis is really emerging as someone whose head is starting to leave the others behind, perhaps Max may be able to challenge him, but sadly Seb seems lost at the moment, but then it only takes one race to change things and opinions, roll on Russia, [am I serious?]
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Post by charleselan on Sept 19, 2018 10:35:46 GMT
I want a master of fiction to write my biography. Isn't Sean Spicer out of a job currently? With hard to focus eyes this morning I read this and thought that Christian Horner had been sacked! Some might get the rather oblique thought.
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Post by mikael on Sept 19, 2018 10:46:58 GMT
"Reports in Italy recently said Ferrari has broken through the 1000 hp barrier with its latest engine, a full 27 hp ahead of Mercedes with its 1005 hp power unit. Renault then currently stands at 950 hp, compared to 930 for Honda."
I always find such data interesting, and they are not stated often. (If they are trustworthy or not is another matter ...)
Source: www.grandprix.com/news/honda-poised-to-pass-renault-for-power.html
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Post by Carl on Sept 19, 2018 16:09:13 GMT
I want a master of fiction to write my biography. Isn't Sean Spicer out of a job currently? Sean isn't qualified. He writes badly and is easily flustered when questioned about bizarre falsehoods. A consummate liar never loses his/her cool. It helps to be a sociopath. The woman now in his position, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, has no concept of truth but probably is too stupid to write a party invitation. I need a Clifford Irving!!
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