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Post by chrisb on Mar 28, 2018 20:09:08 GMT
really do cocur with your comments chaps about the MS forum- and totally agree that Archie would have been an excellent addition, but there were others, bonedwarf springs to mind, even Mark Hughes would be welcome,
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Post by charleselan on Mar 28, 2018 20:23:30 GMT
John Charles, It's a damn shame that some wonderful potential members dropped from sight because of MotorSport's editorial stupidity. -Carl It is indeed Carl as many of those guys would have been so right for this forum of ours. There was an American guy who was also quite good, Rick or Rich something who had a Honda VFR750 that disappeared like Archie when DisGUST arrived on the scene. Out of amusement I have a quick look at MS and the standard of comment continues to astound (negatively); one has the feeling that most on there like a "big forum" as they wish to play to the world wide audience (attention seekers). John Charles |
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Post by mikael on Mar 29, 2018 8:42:53 GMT
In all honesty, I had not heard of Bernard Boyer before Lucio's post. But of course I did a little search and reading about him and the man deserves at least a small tribute by us race fans. He designed some wonderful Matra race cars, Grand Prix cars as well as the legendary Matra sport protoypes. Merci Bernard!  Best sounding sports prototypes ever! |
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Post by René on Mar 29, 2018 11:35:43 GMT
Rene, I also was not familiar with Bernard Boyer, someone to remember as designer of the wonderful V-12 engine that made its passage on the race track so adamantly clear (painfully to some) with a sound more powerful than any cathedral organ, when driven by Chris Amon deserving equal respect to Johann Sebastian Bach.  -Carl Carl, the genius of Johann Sebastian Bach is indisputable and there are not many man-made things that can compete with his creations but the sound of a Matra V12 certainly comes close (and so does a Ferrari flat 12)!   |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2018 18:03:13 GMT
Found on an Italian forum:  |
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Post by mikael on Mar 13, 2023 21:05:17 GMT
Maybe an overly trivial and completely uninteresting thought; but I always enjoyed searching out and watching the small details.
In motocross, for example, each rider definitely has his own peculiar style. But in a less distinctive way, the same is true in Formula One. Some sit back, with the head firmly leaned back on the headrest, appearing always very relaxed. I think that was Jackie Stewart's style. Others keep the head down, looking always very aggressive. Examples of this style are that of Jenson Button and, apparently and more recently, also, that of George Russell.
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Post by René on Mar 13, 2023 22:49:34 GMT
Not trivial at all! Two well known Ferrari drivers were famous for their aggressive attack posture: René Arnoux…
…and Jean Alesi |
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Post by mikael on Mar 25, 2023 9:52:58 GMT
I came across the little film posted below, and thought it might be of interest, although the narration is in the German langue. It's from 1964 and is called "Der Autokult" (The car-cult). It portrays how the popularity of the car "ran amok" in Germany in the "happy sixties" (as this period was called, at least in Denmark). The popularity of the car is viewed here as, "a modern version of the seven plagues of Egypt". Accordingly, it portrays car fans - and racing fans - in a rather negative light. Racing fans, in particular, are viewed as a big-eating, heavily-drinking bunch of "fanatics". (This is the actual word (Ger.: Fanatiker) used by the narrator.)
Still, there are some very interesting scenes from an international sports car race at the Nürburgring, featuring a Le Mans style "run to your cars" type of start (starting at 23:48). Graham Hill can be seen in the center of the screen at 23:50. Interestingly, this race was used, apparently, for a test of the early version of the Ford GT40 - this can be seen at 24:40.
All in all a very interesting flashback in time, even thought it, again, has a negative attitude towards the car, and car racing.
(P.S. Unfortunately, the poster of the movie has not allowed a working link to other sites; but the link leads you to YouTube, where the movie can be seen.)
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Post by René on Mar 25, 2023 10:45:07 GMT
Super interesting. I've watched only a few snippets so far but will watch it again completely later this weekend. A flashback in time indeed.
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Post by Carl on Mar 25, 2023 19:52:34 GMT
Great find, Mikael!
Ironically, heavy traffic congestion was a central reason I left Los Angeles, where I was born and lived more than half a century, so part of me agrees with the point of the producers.
At the risk of seeming fanatical, I found the entry list, confirmed by matching car numbers. My first thought of the start was that the closest driver looks (by helmet design) like John Surtees, who was paired with Lorenzo Bandini in one of three Ferrari 275 Prototypes and on pole by almost 7 seconds! Phil Hill and Bruce McLaren drove the GT40 in its first race and qualified an impressive second on the grid. Also entered in this event popular with fanatical meat-eaters were Jochen Rindt, David Hobbs, Jo Siffert, Bob Bondurant and Jochen Neerpasch in one of several Cobras, Richie Ginther, Jo Bonnier, Richard Attwood and John Whitmore. Dan Gurney and Jim Clark drove in the Indianapolis 500 the day before, in which Eddie Sachs died and Dave McDonald was fatally injured in a terrifying accident exiting Turn 4 on the first lap. --- The following is quoted from Wikipedia ---
During the live radio broadcast of the race, IMS Radio Network anchor Sid Collins drew critical praise for an impromptu on-air eulogy for Eddie Sachs. During the red flag, track public address announcer Tom Carnegie made the official announcement of the death of Sachs: "It is with deepest regret that we make this announcement. Driver Eddie Sachs was fatally injured in the accident on the mainstraightaway." Silence was heard on-air for about five seconds, and at that point, Collins chimed in with a solemn, unprepared eulogy: "You heard the announcement from the public address system. There's not a sound. Men are taking off their hats. People are weeping, over three hundred thousand fans, here; not moving; disbelieving. Some men try to conquer life in a number of ways. These days of our outer space attempts, some men try to conquer the universe. Race drivers are courageous men who try to conquer life and death, and they calculate their risks. And in our talking with them over the years, I think we know their inner thoughts in regards to racing: they take it as part of living. No one is moving on the race track. They're standing silently. A race driver who leaves this earth mentally, when he straps himself into the cockpit, to try what for to him is the biggest conquest he can make, is aware of the odds, and Eddie Sachs played the odds. He was serious and he was fun. He was a wonderful gentleman. And just as the astronauts do perhaps, race drivers ask no quarter and they give none. If they succeed they're a hero, and if they fail, they tried. And it was Eddie's desire and will to try with everything he had, which he always did. So the only healthy way perhaps we can approach the tragedy of the loss of a friend like Eddie Sachs is to know that he would have wanted us to face it, as he did: as it has happened, not as we wish it would have happened. It is God's will, I'm sure, and we must accept that. We're all speeding towards death at the rate of sixty minutes every hour. The only difference is that we don't know how to speed faster, and Eddie Sachs did. So as since death has a thousand or more doors, Eddie Sachs exits this earth in a race car. And knowing Eddie, I assume that's the way he would have wanted it... ...Byron said 'who the gods love, die young'. Eddie was 37. To his widow Nance we extend our extreme sympathy and regret. And to his two children. This man won the pole here in 1960 and 1961 and was a proud race driver. Well, as we do at Indianapolis and in racing all over the world: the race continues. Unfortunately today, without Eddie Sachs. And we'll be restarting it in just a few moments."
I was a young motorsport fan listening with friends to the radio broadcast. Sid Collins somehow found an amazing presence of mind and clarity of thought and we were blown away.
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Post by mikael on Mar 25, 2023 20:40:44 GMT
A very interesting post, Carl - thank you.
Yes, an interesting movie; but the narrator is really very (overly) arrogant and condescending towards "car people" of any kind. Yet, at the same time, he cannot avoid to tell how significant the car industry is to the booming German postwar economy.
Apparently he had forgotten that his country was completely flattened due to WWII just twenty years earlier. Yet I'm sure he enjoyed the new prosperity of his country just as much as anybody else. But, don't bite the hand that feeds you, it is said. This is something that the narrator failed to realize, apparently.
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Post by chrisb on Mar 25, 2023 21:01:43 GMT
That is a lovely tribute Carl, I once saw an interview with Eddie after the 1963 Indy 500 where he was very unhappy with Parnelli for dropping’that oil’
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Post by Carl on Mar 26, 2023 0:13:20 GMT
A very interesting post, Carl - thank you.
Yes, an interesting movie; but the narrator is really very (overly) arrogant and condescending towards "car people" of any kind. Yet, at the same time, he cannot avoid to tell how significant the car industry is to the booming German postwar economy.
Apparently he had forgotten that his country was completely flattened due to WWII just twenty years earlier. Yet I'm sure he enjoyed the new prosperity of his country just as much as anybody else. But, don't bite the hand that feeds you, it is said. This is something that the narrator failed to realize, apparently.
I agree. The central narrative reeks of hypocrisy. |
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Post by René on Mar 26, 2023 10:26:02 GMT
A very interesting post, Carl - thank you.
Yes, an interesting movie; but the narrator is really very (overly) arrogant and condescending towards "car people" of any kind. Yet, at the same time, he cannot avoid to tell how significant the car industry is to the booming German postwar economy.
Apparently he had forgotten that his country was completely flattened due to WWII just twenty years earlier. Yet I'm sure he enjoyed the new prosperity of his country just as much as anybody else. But, don't bite the hand that feeds you, it is said. This is something that the narrator failed to realize, apparently.
I agree. The central narrative reeks of hypocrisy. But maybe he lived in a tent and ate homemade lentil soup every day? Just sayin'...  |
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Post by Carl on Mar 26, 2023 18:35:47 GMT
A very interesting post, Carl - thank you.
Yes, an interesting movie; but the narrator is really very (overly) arrogant and condescending towards "car people" of any kind. Yet, at the same time, he cannot avoid to tell how significant the car industry is to the booming German postwar economy.
Apparently he had forgotten that his country was completely flattened due to WWII just twenty years earlier. Yet I'm sure he enjoyed the new prosperity of his country just as much as anybody else. But, don't bite the hand that feeds you, it is said. This is something that the narrator failed to realize, apparently.
Mikael, In my haste to commend your research, I chose misleading words. I meant that your effort was great, not the film itself, which you accurately describe. The director, Wilhelm Bittorf, may have been inspired by American safety crusader Ralph Nader, whose zeal was almost messianic. The effect of his 1965 book, Unsafe at Any Speed, was to doom a very good car, the rear-engine Chevrolet Corvair, because of a swinging arm rear suspension which admittedly could be dangerous. Nader's laser focus suggests he never knew that the same rear suspension was installed on many cars across the globe. General Motors had already installed a fully independent rear suspension on the Corvair before the book was published, but it was too late. Nader was as foolish as the car buying public, but he was right to blast car manufacturers for their resistance to safety improvements because added expense meant fewer sales and less profit. He remained a zealous and quixotic crusader who helped spur the federal government to pass safety legislation that saved lives, and ran for president four times. As a classic example of the law of unintended consequences, his 2000 Green Party campaign unwittingly drew support away from Al Gore and helped elect the idiotic George W. Bush. Deliver us from crusaders who live in caves, eat lentil soup and would save us from ourselves. They are the fanatics. Cheers, Carl |
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