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Post by Carl on Jan 8, 2019 21:45:55 GMT
This is a fascinating cockpit view of a beautifully restored Boeing B-17G with a crew of oldtimers as they start the engines and prepare for flight. There are some wonderful scenes during flight from the bombardier's position. On the B-17G model, there were four massive .50 caliber machine guns at his disposal, two in a remote turret beneath and one on each side controlled directly. Its defensive armament is why this workhorse bomber was called the Flying Fortress
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Post by Carl on Jan 8, 2019 21:56:59 GMT
Here's a wonderful French fighter plane and its American pilot, Eddie Rickenbacker. His German name illustrates the melting pot diversity formerly treasured in America, although not by the German pilots he shot down. His SPAD-XIII was built by the Société Pour L'Aviation et ses Dérivés and had an impressive top speed of 135 mph.
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Post by mikael on Jan 9, 2019 2:02:58 GMT
Carl, when seeing this video, and seeing that such old aircraft are being used, I came to think about what I learned in such courses as "Strength of Materials", "Metallurgy", etc., long time ago: that aluminum has a fatigue life, or a fatigue limit. This means that, no matter how small a stress level an aluminum structure is subjected to, at some point (in time) it will fail, that is, start to develop cracks and break. This is different from steel; here there is stress level below which the structure/material will not fail for any number of bending-cycles. Thus a steel structure can, in principle, be used forever, but not an aluminum structure.
Thus when these old aircraft are being used, they cannot in any way be kept in original condition; parts of the wings and the shell need to be changed periodically.
This applies of course also to old racing cars with an aluminum chassis that are being raced: they cannot in any way be kept in original condition.
But of course, I guess that using these old vehicles is what makes it worthwhile to own them - and so it can't be helped that they will become more and more non-authentic, so to say ...
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Post by Carl on Jan 9, 2019 5:38:39 GMT
Mikael, Very interesting analysis from an engineering perspective! To me, a restored airplane, although not original, remains authentic when precisely in accordance with original blueprints. Most important is airworthiness.  Here are some classic examples of B-17 "nose art". The Memphis Belle is the most famous B-17 because of a combat mission documentary by William Wyler
This one's from a photo of Betty Grable > 
Happy Landings, Carl  |
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Post by mikael on Jan 9, 2019 6:59:28 GMT
I wonder which job would be the most frightening one, that of the tail gunner or that of the nose gunner ... (It might be like choosing between pest and cholera ...)
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Post by René on Jan 9, 2019 18:58:51 GMT
Great stuff Carl. The video of the B-17G is wonderful and the view from the bombardier's position is scary! Those plains are just amazing and the guys who flew them over enemy territory were very brave indeed. Here are a few pictures I really like. Lockheed P-38  A colorized photo of some Mosquitos.  |
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Post by Carl on Jan 9, 2019 21:10:37 GMT
Very cool photos, Rene!
The P-38 was one of the fastest planes of World War II at almost 450 mph. A squadron of P-38s shot down the architect of the attack of Pearl Harbor, thanks to an intelligence intercept, in 1943. One of the British pilots is scratching his head as the group are possibly introduced to their intended airplane, a very effective fighter-bomber first deployed in 1940. |
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Post by Carl on Jan 9, 2019 21:24:07 GMT
I wonder which job would be the most frightening one, that of the tail gunner or that of the nose gunner ... (It might be like choosing between pest and cholera ...) Both were dangerous positions as frontal and rear attacks were common tactics. Probably the tail gunner was most vulnerable after German pilots discovered they could approach and hover hidden from the other guns, destroy the tail-gun position with cannon fire, then target the engines. This tactic was most effective if the German pilots could first scatter the tight formation that allowed the bombers to protect others in their squadron with cross-fire.
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Post by chrisb on Jan 9, 2019 21:44:18 GMT
wonderful chaps, I shudder at the thought of being either a tail gunner or a nose gunner in those things, or their successor come to that, but it is wonderful to be able to pay my respects to those who did,
Mikael, brilliant, I would have had no idea of this and wonder as Rene has very kindly shown a picture of my all-time favourite airplane, the De Havilland Mosquito being of wooden construction would it's rebuild mean a complete new chassis so to speak,
Rene, lovely photo's sorry I know the P38 was the most successful fighter plane of I guess all time but for me, it just doesn't have the grace of the Spitfire, although I am told the Yak [was it?] was a very successful plane as well?
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Post by Carl on Jan 10, 2019 4:49:49 GMT
Chris, "Fighter plane" is a wonderfully precise description! The P-38 was fast and successful indeed, but ungainly with its two engine layout whereas the Spitfire had great success and by far the most graceful design. It excelled in plane to plane combat while the P-38 had other tactical advantages. The development of fighter aircraft was similar to Formula One today, with constant enhancements. The Japanese Zero was the best fighter plane when first deployed, but inadequate development and the loss of hundreds of experienced pilots at the Battle of Midway in early June, 1942, was crippling to its air power. I don't know much about Russian weaponry, but as you suggested, they eventually matched the Germans in fighter planes (the Yakovlev 1-2 and 3) and surpassed them in tank warfare. War greatly benefits weapons technology while destroying everything else.
Hooray for our side? -Carl
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Post by mikael on Jan 10, 2019 14:35:10 GMT
... wonder as Rene has very kindly shown a picture of my all-time favourite airplane, the De Havilland Mosquito being of wooden construction would it's rebuild mean a complete new chassis so to speak
Chris, I believe that wood behaves like aluminum with respect to fatigue, but I'm not fully sure; it's something I need to check.
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Post by René on Jan 10, 2019 18:26:50 GMT
Rene, lovely photo's sorry I know the P38 was the most successful fighter plane of I guess all time but for me, it just doesn't have the grace of the Spitfire, although I am told the Yak [was it?] was a very successful plane as well? I agree Chris, the Spitfire is the more beautiful airplane. But I love the photo of the P-38 I posted because it just looks surreal the way the pilot “hangs” between the wings. |
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Post by René on Jan 10, 2019 18:47:00 GMT
War greatly benefits weapons technology while destroying everything else. So true Carl, so true. Talking about war, did any of you see the film documentary “They shall not grow old” by Peter Jackson? It’s about the great war and it’s mighty impressive the way it is made. It is told from the British perspective, starting with the recruitment of the men and young boys to go to war and then how they fight and live in the trenches. All footage is original film made at the time so in black and white and not very good quality. But then at some point in the documentary the quality of film suddenly turns to full colour and almost in HD while still original film. They have enhanced the old footage with the latest technology and the result just grabs you by the throat. You can’t believe you’re watching over a hundred years old footage and it just comes so close by. A must see. |
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Post by Carl on Jan 10, 2019 21:32:23 GMT
War greatly benefits weapons technology while destroying everything else. So true Carl, so true. Talking about war, did any of you see the film documentary “They shall not grow old” by Peter Jackson? It’s about the great war and it’s mighty impressive the way it is made. It is told from the British perspective, starting with the recruitment of the men and young boys to go to war and then how they fight and live in the trenches. All footage is original film made at the time so in black and white and not very good quality. But then at some point in the documentary the quality of film suddenly turns to full colour and almost in HD while still original film. They have enhanced the old footage with the latest technology and the result just grabs you by the throat. You can’t believe you’re watching over a hundred years old footage and it just comes so close by. A must see. Rene, I've heard and read about it and I'm eager to see it. What an ingenious concept to bring the old images to life, as though they were filmed last week. Thanks to your reminder, I checked and it's being shown one-day only on January 21 at my local movie palace. I called the box-office and will visit soon to secure an advance ticket. Many thanks, Rene!
I saw a fascinating documentary on cable channel CSPAN about an American military historian and a French local with extensive knowledge touring the Meuse-Argonne battlegrounds, a 47 day offensive late in 1918 that convinced the Germans to capitulate.
Because the area has protected status, the trenches are still there, although partly filled in over time by erosion. At one point, they come upon an unexploded 75mm cannon shell, having been exposed and dislodged by recent rains.
Two Americans bound for future prominence are briefly featured, tank commander at the time George S Patton and artillery Captain at the time Harry Truman.
Because of the detailed comparison of small village churches and town squares then and now, it's a fascinating historical documentary.
Cheers, Carl
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Post by chrisb on Jan 11, 2019 9:00:09 GMT
Rene, do you mean the incredible WW1 documentary 'they shall not grow old?' it is so breathtaking and a bit surreal but so poignant, heartbreakingly so,
There is a wonderful documentary about the most amazing British pilot I think there has ever been, someone who sadly passed away last year, Captain Eric 'Winkle'Brown, it really is an amazing story,
On a personal note both my Grandfathers fought in both WW's, my paternal one [ex-Eton and Sandhurst] earned a great many medals and distinctions in WW1 but not the VC and my maternal Grandfather was a balloon observer at the Somme - which would have been akin to the rear gunner spot I think, incredible people my maternal Grandfather was incredibly self-effacing about it and I didn't know much about it till after his passing. He also went onto be a Lieutenant Colonel in the Bengal light cavalry in WW2 as well as the acting Norweigan Ambassador although of German ancestry, which must have been truly incredible my paternal served at D-Day with the engineers both at the same rank, fascinating people,
I don't know if any of you have had the chance to go to Ypres? outside of family and friends the most emotional moment I have experienced was listening to the last-post at that Menin Gate, truly breathtaking
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