Fernando Alonso quits F1

[René]

You guys probably have all read the news but the news is too big to ignore. Not a huge surprise and I guess he will move to Indycar racing. He'll probably have a pre-contract with Andretti in his pocket already!

A difficult character and not always the most likeable person but a great driver, still one of the best I think. Two world titles are not enough for a man of his talent and he really should have won the 2010 title with Ferrari. That would have made his legacy so much greater.

I do know I will follow Indycar with even more interest now.

[Deleted]

Today the sport is so consolidated in only two teams capable to win, that there is no room for everybody at the top. Max surely has taken notice of that.

A couple of thoughts come to mind, both of which require a supplement of investigation, for myself.

One. How much a rookie like Hamilton dented his confidence when he was the holding champion, twice in a row. (as well as setting up a chain of events that seemingly reverberated all through his remaining F1 career)

Two. Had he not gone to Ferrari in 2010, could things have turned for the better eventually? Perhaps not, RB was already closed shop and at Merc he was perhaps persona non grata.

Must say, I have always found it unbelievable that he wasn’t privy to what his team was up to at Singapore.

[charleselan]

Not in the least surprised to read this news today, and to be completely open I have little sympathies with the man. O.K. he was quick and relentless as a driver, of that there is no doubt; but ranked as one of the all time greats. no chance.

To be a great you do not denigrate the teams you drive for in public, even when things are not going well. You also do not constantly big yourself up in the media, and do the opposite to past and present team mates.

His actions out of the car, go before him. He did not get the nick name "Teflonso" for nothing, funny that it disappeared after a short period of time.

Alonso's conduct during his first term at McLaren was disgusting , made even more so when he pulled "squealers charter" to get out of being involved in the Ferrari gate affair. That then paled in comparison with what happened in Singapore, the compelling circumstantial  evidence  is there for all to see.

Maybe he will head off to Formula E and join his old mate Massa, and then await the words " Fernando has more battery power than you"...............

[robmarsh]

Aug 14, 2018 18:44:44 GMT René said:

You guys probably have all read the news but the news is too big to ignore. Not a huge surprise and I guess he will move to Indycar racing. He'll probably have a pre-contract with Andretti in his pocket already!

A difficult character and not always the most likeable person but a great driver, still one of the best I think. Two world titles are not enough for a man of his talent and he really should have won the 2010 title with Ferrari. That would have made his legacy so much greater.

I do know I will follow Indycar with even more interest now.

I agree with you René. I think at least three titles. I liked Alonso's driving. His behaviour outside of the car was not so good after he went to Mclaren and came across Lewis, who is an exceptional talent. That situation reminded me so much of Piquet and Williams in 1986. In both cases the English team owner under estimated the speed of their English drivers, made promises they thought were easy to keep, and then went back on their words when their countrymen proved otherwise. Both of those instances of poor management and going back on the deal killed the previous respect I held those two team owners' in. Ironically in both cases the Latin drivers' careers began to founder after that.

[Deleted]

Interesting parallel, Rob. I agree on the mismanagement. Piquet slowed down sensibly after an encounter of the third kind with the wall at Tamburello that year and Mansell wasn’t a rookie, far from it. And Hamilton and Alonso are better drivers than Mansell and Piquet both have ever been. Otherwise it’s the sport as it should be, a team sports as far as the people who gives you the car are concerned, but utterly individual when it comes to your teammate. The management either acknowledge that situation and manage it the best they can, or they’d struggle to keep up with their own drivers, when both are thoroughbreds. It can be easier when they have the dominant car – Senna’s and Prost’s McLaren, or Lewis’ and Nico’s Mercs – otherwise it can be a nightmare for a weak management. Alonso (and Piquet) was used to have the team working for himself only and apparently couldn’t handle it any other way. I say, that is a limit, which puts Lewis Hamilton on top of Alonso anytime they will write an history book in the future, beside other considerations. (Mansell was quicker than that Piquet, not sure he was a better driver overall)

[Deleted]

Reading all the post-mortem on MS: Hughes, the various posters, etc. "Ferocity", "ferocious", he used that for Ricciardo too last week, looks like he is discovering America (as they use to say in Italy for obvious observations).

I don't know, Nando Alonso, it is surely my limit I failed to appreciate him. I prefer Lewis.

[robmarsh]

Yep Lucio. Hamilton and Alonso are better than Mansell and Piquet were. Hamilton is a great talent and has been very astute in picking which team to drive for and when. A true weapon in any great driver's handbook. Alonso as pointed out by others, not so good.

Incidently, Piquet reckoned that crash at Tamburello affected him for at least the rest of the season. He used to have no problem sleeping for 10 hours a night before the crash but could only sleep for three to fours after. His whole body was disturbed by the impact. He never was the same after that as a driver.

[Deleted]

Hughes makes a valid point in highlighting the fact Hamilton's rise coincided with Alonso's struggles. Alonso thought, reasonably, that after Schumacher he was going to be the next top dog and instead Hamilton, then Vettel, came along to cut his choices of seats.

That misstep ultimately created room for Lewis Hamilton’s career to grow in the way it did, by giving him a free run at McLaren and by relegating his number one rival to a lesser car for the duration of his career.

[René]

"You can rate people that they had bad luck and bad cars. I think people overrate him. One of his problems is he seems to upset teams and everybody around him. That's not the way to win world championships. You've got to work with your team and you're nearly a leader [as a driver]."

Jody Scheckter on Alonso



Source: Autosport

[Carl]

Sherlock Holmes might put down his violin and tell Watson to arrange passage to Indianapolis.  Because the game is now afoot. Fernando Alonso blunders because he's not clever enough to be deceitful, made worse by having learned ethics from the atrocious Flavio Briatore.

[charleselan]

In a MS Pod Cast some time back Jody was scathing of Teflonso, mainly for his behaviour when at McLaren. Jody always had a good grasp on fair play and decency, shame there aren't more like him.

I find it rather hard to align myself with the idea that Hamilton & Alonso are better than Piquet & Mansell, how do we know as they are from entirely different era's. One thing I do know is that Piquet was far more clever than either Alonso or Hamilton, and I would not bet against Mansell in a dog fight with either of them.

[Carl]

Aug 15, 2018 17:26:37 GMT charleselan said:

One thing I do know is that Piquet was far more clever than either Alonso or Hamilton, and I would not bet against Mansell in a dog fight with either of them.

A perfect analysis! 

As they say in England, spot on! 

As the more long-winded would say, Johnny on the spot. 

Or the very particular Goldilocks, damn right!

[René]

Aug 15, 2018 17:26:37 GMT charleselan said:

In a MS Pod Cast some time back Jody was scathing of Teflonso, mainly for his behaviour when at McLaren. Jody always had a good grasp on fair play and decency, shame there aren't more like him.

I find it rather hard to align myself with the idea that Hamilton & Alonso are better than Piquet & Mansell, how do we know as they are from entirely different era's. One thing I do know is that Piquet was far more clever than either Alonso or Hamilton, and I would not bet against Mansell in a dog fight with either of them.

I agree it is impossible to compare drivers from different eras. I do believe that the best and most talented will always rise to the top though. If Hamilton and Alonso had been born a few decades earlier they would still have been winners and that also goes the other way round. At least that's how I see it.

The main difference between now and then is the professionalism and training from a very young age. We've seen that development in all major sports. The great national soccer teams of the sixties/seventies like the Brazilians with Pelé or the Dutch with Cruijff were brilliant but they wouldn't stand a chance against a contemporary team. The game has become much faster and more organized. Just watch the old footage, it's slow. 

The same goes for F1. All modern drivers started karting at a very young age and they practise all the time in the simulator and do a lot of exercise with special diets. The talent is the same but everything else has become vastly more professional.

[mikael]

Sorry ;-) I could not resists posting this - one of the most amusing variations (Photoshop-creations) of the "deckchair incident" a few years ago (and just timely - now in F1's summer vacation).

[mikael]

Aug 15, 2018 22:34:32 GMT René said:

I agree it is impossible to compare drivers from different eras. I do believe that the best and most talented will always rise to the top though.
...
The talent is the same but everything else has become vastly more professional.

So, do you think the general level (say, the "ground level") in F1 has become higher (if one looks apart from a number of "pay-drivers")? For certain eras gone by, it is sometimes said about the best few that they "stood head and shoulders above their contemporaries". Examples are Fangio and Moss (50's), Clark (60's), Stewart (early 70's), maybe Senna and Prost in the 80's/90's, and Schumacher in his prime. But for the more recent F1-generations that grew up on karting circuits, has there been anyone who, in terms of ability, really stood head and shoulders above the rest?