Spanish Grand Prix - Barcelona

[René]

The usual 1-2-3 but the Pink Mercs now really showed their speed.

Ferrari is hurting a lot on this track (and me too) and it was painful to see Sebastian miss out on Q3. But the gap to Charles was very small..

Disappointing also for Renault and the Haas cars were nowhere. JC, I think we're right with that special engine they put in Romain's car yesterday! Very weird.

[charleselan]

Well that was fun............

Only thousands in it but could have been whole seconds; poor old Max gives it his all and can't even get close in third place. It looks like Hamilton has all but tied up another championship, surely even he feels it is hollow. All this "Valterri pushed me so hard" is just b*;;s, if he really did he would not be talking him up, remember Nico?

What we need to see, and now, is Max; Charles and the McLaren boys in equal equipment pushing Hamilton to the max; and yes George in the second MB.

The best bit for me in the S*YF1 coverage today was the little cameo put on with the McLaren lads, it was hilarious, such a shame those two are being split up as they are amazing together.

Good to see Kimi get that dog of an Alfa Romeo into Q2, he absolutely thrashed that thing.

[robmarsh]

To be honest, with the exception of 2008, I find all of LH's championships a bit hollow. He has clearly been the favoured driver and Nico Rosberg was either sanctioned, pushed off the track or rebuked when he tried to beat LH in an equal car. Eventually Merc realised that they needed to let Nico get on with things his way because another LH title would be counter productive. I think there is still a big story coming from Nico about why he really left Merc the way he did. There is no way LH would be nice to Valteri if he was beating him consistently.

I watched the 1998 Hungarian GP last night. MS really drove the wheels off the Ferrari to beat the two McLarens that day. His Ferrari was about a second off the pace in practice I think. Although MS won five championships on the trot with Ferrari, with the exception of 2002 and 2004 he did not have the same car advantage that Mercedes have had consistently for the last seven years.

I think Ferrari will go better in the race maybe 4th and 6th and hopefully Max will challenge the Mercs.

[charleselan]

Rob,

A very good friend of mine works for a company that has links with a similar German set up and a short while after that season of discontent (Nico Spa incident we have discussed earlier), two German technicians spent one week in the UK at my friends plant. They were very keen motor racing fans and were very angry at how the final race of the season panned out; Nico having that mysterious engine problem that prevented him challenging Hamilton for the championship victory.

These two guys said that on German TV it was divulged that in fact Nico's car had no fault what so ever, Keke had also been interviewed and he also said the same! One of the reasons I wouldn't trust Tonto to make me a a cup of coffee .

I wonder if Nico ever will give more reasons why he decided to retire, it could be interesting .

JC

[robmarsh]

Doesn't surprise me one bit Charles. I wouldn't trust Tonto either. Eventually those sort of people get found out and things begin to unravel badly. Looking at the interview with Tonto yesterday on Sky things may have started to unravel already.

I watched a nice little programme on Sky of Johnny Herbert and Damon Hill sitting in a cinema commenting on the 1995 British GP. It was very heart warming to see how the two interacted and what absolute gentlemen those two chaps are. They also didn't hold back on the criticisms of Briatore or how they were treated by the respective managements at Benetton and Williams, they just did it in a nice steel fist in a velvet glove way, almost dismissive in fact. Lovely to see and my estimation of both of them has gone up another notch or two.

[charleselan]

Where to begin!

I hate this circuit as it is totally unsuited to F1 cars and always produces a race that is like watching slow setting paint dry. According to the S*YF1 presentation team it was a master class from Hamilton who won against the odds, or that is my interpretation of their sad jingoism. The Fizzy Drinks team were apparently favourites to win but it was the multiple world champions amazing ability to manage his tyres, select the right tyres at the right time and absolute brilliance that one him the race.

For goodness sake even a rampant Max Verstappen knew from the outset it was not going to be his day even if he got the drop on Bottas at the start, along with several others. Bottas nice lad, and a good driver; also an excellent number two.

Ferrari were a shambles and this dismal circuit highlighted their totally inadequate vehicle, compounded by a stupid failure that ended the race for a very frustrated Charles Leclerc. One positive was the fact that Sebastian drove a very sound race indeed which must do wonders for his confidence. However his radio transmissions brought into clarity the broken relationship with the team, and none of his doing.

One other positive was the outstanding drive by Sainz Jnr, a truly brilliant drive. Fizzy Drinks were morons to let that lad go, but then again it would have prevented them from making Max such a "super star".

After watching the dramas and horrors of MotoGP from Austria this illustrated the fact that F1 can do far better than this.

[robmarsh]

All I can add is that I agree. A most boring race.

[Carl]

There were a few dramatic moments that interrupted an almost constant focus on tyre strategy.

Nico Rosberg astonished David Croft on Saturday by explaining how certain corners are more important than others.  As always, Martin Brundle offered the only wisdom among the usual suspects, notably his rueful observation that tyre management has always been important but should not be predominant. 

[René]

Not much to add. What a borefest!

Barcelona is a fine test track but a terrible race track. Hamilton may be 'in a different zone' as he said afterwards but F1 is choking on days like these.

[robmarsh]

Aug 17, 2020 14:57:40 GMT René said:

Not much to add. What a borefest!

Barcelona is a fine test track but a terrible race track. Hamilton may be 'in a different zone' as he said afterwards but F1 is choking on days like these.

Mercedes is killing what's left of F1.  Ferrari need a matchbox to give them any chance of thinking outside of it.

[chrisb]

I haven't watched it, and have no intention of doing so,

MB, they do have a history, pre-war was awesome, but noticeably without the charisma of a Rosemayer or Nuvolari, and 1954/5 they were simply so far ahead, although with investment the Lancia with Ascari looked like they could challenge them, until fate stepped in, but this current domination is just negative, proves nothing and it is questionable what it achieves, until such time this is realised the other teams will just feed off the scraps as I just don't see anyone really challenging MB on an equal footing

John, interesting point, I was over the moon that someone from humble beginnings and of non-white ancestry made it and he was good very very good, in F2 he was class, but the titles and accolades are tainted by a lack of direct competition, Nico proving that both Lewis and Michael were beatable and knowing there was more to life than having everything stacked against you, I wonder could that accusation be transferred to other champions? possibly but then their competitors had cars that could challenge them, now it is division one, Lewis, division two Bottas and the pink cars, with Max showing occassionaly Div 3 the rest- no wonder apathy sits well with F1, perhaps when Tonto goes so will MB - 

[charleselan]

I have no problem admitting that Lewis Hamilton is a great racing drive and applaud the fact that he rose from humble beginnings and overcame racial differences which is no small achievement. However winning with the best equipment over such a long period does nothing for his ratings in comparison with many of the greats from the past.

Even when at McLaren he had a half reasonable car and strong team behind him, when it was not at its best, so he has never really challenged himself. I was no big fan of Michael Schumacher but acknowledge that he was prepared to challenge himself by moving to Ferrari when it was in as bad a state as it is now.

Many of the greats from the past have driven what dear old Gilles referred to as "sh*t boxes" and put them in places they had no business being in, that is the sign of true greatness in my opinion. Lewis Hamilton is never going to drive for anyone but MB for the rest of his career no matter what the rumour mongers try to intimate. If he were to go to say "Pink MB" along with his mate Tonto and drag that up by its boot straps then we would be looking at a different scenario.

The best thing that can happen to F1 right now would be for MB to pull the plug as a team, maybe supply power plants or whatever they are called these days. A suggestion that some of our esteemed fellow commenters have also wavered. Most major car manufacturers are only interested in electric cars now, so for them the tedious Formula E is their centre of interest. Formula One should be like MotoGP and concentrate on I/C engines and a drivers championship, it will take decades before people who love motor sport would ditch the I/C engine as it is still relevant today.

[mikael]

From another point of view it's impressive that Mercedes-Benz (MB) have been able to take such a "quantum leap" each year in the present era - even if they're well-funded. (Toyota (in the early 00's) were also generously funded; yet, in the end, they got very little out of it.) Racing Point may be a good yardstick. If their present car corresponds to the 2019 MB, then what they - as well as any other team - have achieved is to - just barely - catch up with the late-2019-season-level MB.

It's not just the engine - it seems that MB have become better and more innovative in any area (like the new steering system - an amazing idea!).

In one sense, it's disappointing that another manufacturer-team like Renault aren't putting in greater efforts, and that they - with their spectacular history and heritage - apparently have "thrown the towel in the ring" and are content of being, basically, a mid-field team. In other eras they were true pioneers (like with the 1.5L turbo engine in the mid/late 70's). In the present era they haven't displayed one single original idea, as far as I know.

----

As to the GP (I watched it from start to end on German RTL), I think that the TV producer could do a much better job in portraying the sheer beauty of high-precision driving (as done so well in movies like "Grand Prix", "Le Mans", and "Nine Days in Summer"). TV is always action- and drama-focussed - and this becomes tiresome in races where there aren't that much drama. When, say, the leader of the race drives "like a clockwork" - that could be *portrayed* in a good (i.e., better) way, such that the viewers can understand and admire it. 

[Carl]

The worst possible characteristic now dominates Formula One: boredom. Mercedes-Benz, as it always has, dominates to such a degree that few are inspired to rise to the challenge.  I wonder why Mercedes-Benz itself hasn't gotten bored and left the sport. I suppose the demands of various types of greed.

I agree with Mikael that television's presentation could be greatly improved with more creative production, but that would cost money and networks are notoriously cheap.

I cheered Lewis Hamilton until he became his own greatest fan. The indulgent pampering of celebrities in general by society, and of great natural talents in racing, is crass and mindless and leaves a bad taste in the mouth of true fans of the sport. Whatever else drew the greatest driver of the modern era to Lotus, Jim Clark was too genuine to be mollycoddled.

Alfred Hitchcock was asked once by interviewer Dick Cavett which human trait most frightened the master of horror and suspense.  His very smart answer was "stupidity".

[chrisb]

Good point Mikael, you have Fiat, Renault amongst others who have simply not kept up with MB and they too must shoulder some of the blame for the current domination, and the Toyota example is an excellent one of throwing money at the committee with little effect. However, for me I still question as to what MB gets out of this domination,

One of the biggest follies of the modern era was putting F1 behind a pay wall, inciting commentators to try and enliven up something that is not as exciting as it could be, we have seen cars and drivers throughout history having periods of domination but this is something else which leads the question what do I want from F1? do I want a technical feast of brilliant engineering, with cars that run on rails and defy logic to take a corner at a certain speed and brake/ accelerate beyond comprehension or do I want something else, there is no benefit of returning to days yore - I do know that I would like a decent commentator and to feel the speed this things go, neither of which is made clear on current TV,