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Post by René on Jul 16, 2020 15:31:54 GMT
Round 3 of this strange championship. Will we see a Mercedes walkover or can Red Bull put them on serious pressure? A Ferrari recovery seems highly unlikely but it can’t posiibly get any worse than last weekend. Forza! And what about the pink cars? Can they put pressure on Red Bull? And McLaren could also do well on this twisty track. Ah well, there’s always hope for a good race!
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Post by chrisb on Jul 17, 2020 6:12:49 GMT
whilst the circuit on TV does not look a really 'great' circuit I thoroughly enjoyed my visit there [not sure the year but it was when Massa got injured in practice and Kimi won] - it was a really nice place to visit and you got up close and personal to the circuit - it sort of reminded me I suppose of some UK club circuits with better facilities and I did like the racing there, the Poles were there in force as were the Finns and they really do party but with no damage to any other person or property only their hangovers
as for the race, with a 'division one' driver the pink cars will definitely be there but just cannot see Perez as a winner unless its a tyre management win, and his team-mate - no comment
I just see yet another Merc win, incidentally did Tonto sell his shares in Williams? just something somewhere suggested he may be interested in his own team....
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Post by robmarsh on Jul 17, 2020 7:38:55 GMT
2009 was when you were there Chris. Ferrari were starting to come good after an awful start to the season. I am not sure if Tonto sold his shares in Williams though. He does have shares in Aston Martin (RP) and the Merc team. The thought crossed my mind the other day if he is not trying to become BCE season 2!
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Post by René on Jul 17, 2020 10:27:13 GMT
In 2009 it was actually Hamilton who won with McLaren, the first win for a hybrid system (KERS). But you're right Rob, Ferrari did came good later in the season and Kimi finished second on the Hungaroring, third in Valencia and won in Belgium. It was sad for Massa though that he couldn't enjoy the improved Ferrari. But good of course that he survived, that was a nasty accident. It is a nice circuit to visit Chris. I was there in 2003 when Alonso won his first Grand Prix. Indeed a lot of Fins there, real party animals! Budapest is also a great city to visit.
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Post by Carl on Jul 17, 2020 16:20:20 GMT
Turn 4 is fast and a real challenge, but the final corners show Tilke's lack of imagination. He drew himself into a corner from which mickey mouse offered the only escape.
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Post by René on Jul 17, 2020 17:04:33 GMT
Turn 4 is fast and a real challenge, but the final corners show Tilke's lack of imagination. He drew himself into a corner from which mickey mouse offered the only escape. Tilke's lack of imagination is beyond discussion but actually, the Hungaroring was not designed by Tilke but by Hungarian architect Ferenc Gulácsi. Indeed labeled as a Mickey Mouse track because of its twisty nature and compared to the classic tracks that were gradually removed from the calendar in the 1980's. By now this circuit is seen by many as a classic track... well, it's been around since 1986 so not entirely untrue.
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Post by charleselan on Jul 17, 2020 17:40:14 GMT
When it first came on the calendar many referred to the Hungaroring as a Kart Track due to its tight fiddly nature. I have never really been a big fan myself and in reality not really suited to what is sup[posed to be a Grand Prix event.
Great for the Finns & Poles who travel there thanks to not having anything themselves; a travesty for Finland however as they have had, and still do, some high profile drivers.
Talking of the 2009 race, I would have to say that is when Kimi came alive in that under developed truck that Ferrari produced that year. His drive to 2nd place that year was an outstanding performance, as was the Belgian GP victory which few thought would happen. He was then still at the height of his powers then and probably still a bit narked at being replaced by Teflonso. He was never the same after those years out of F1 in my opinion.
I also think that Felippe's accident helped him to some extent, as he then had the full interest of the team behind him in the cars set-up. Felippe Massa had for some time been the guy that led the development of the cars, even in Michael's final year, and the cars did not suit Kimi or Michael. The cars were prone to excessive understeer which neither liked, and in Kimi's case only balanced out as the race drew to a close with light fuel tanks.
In some respects Kimi's own fault as he should have been far more demonstrative like Teflonso happens to be.
Edit P.S.
has anyone seen the Alfa Romeo Stelvio advert that appears on the S*YF1 transmission. It features Kimi in the car and he looks so James Bond like in the images, could almost be the brother of Daniel Craig but not his likeness I might add.
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Post by Carl on Jul 17, 2020 18:04:47 GMT
Turn 4 is fast and a real challenge, but the final corners show Tilke's lack of imagination. He drew himself into a corner from which mickey mouse offered the only escape. Tilke's lack of imagination is beyond discussion but actually, the Hungaroring was not designed by Tilke but by Hungarian architect Ferenc Gulácsi. Indeed labeled as a Mickey Mouse track because of its twisty nature and compared to the classic tracks that were gradually removed from the calendar in the 1980's. By now this circuit is seen by many as a classic track... well, it's been around since 1986 so not entirely untrue. Granted that Ferenc Gulácsi designed it, but he used Hermann Tilke's imagination!
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Post by René on Jul 17, 2020 20:14:58 GMT
Tilke's lack of imagination is beyond discussion but actually, the Hungaroring was not designed by Tilke but by Hungarian architect Ferenc Gulácsi. Indeed labeled as a Mickey Mouse track because of its twisty nature and compared to the classic tracks that were gradually removed from the calendar in the 1980's. By now this circuit is seen by many as a classic track... well, it's been around since 1986 so not entirely untrue. Granted that Ferenc Gulácsi designed it, but he used Hermann Tilke's imagination! Granted.
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Post by René on Jul 18, 2020 14:36:03 GMT
Interesting qualy results. Mercedes is obviously in a league of its own, my god that car is on rails!
Second row for the pink Mercs with a third position for Lance Stroll. That was a very good lap by the Canadian and Racing Point is now clearly the second best team.
Good to see Ferrari is finding some pace so that was a hopeful session. Race pace is not bad so a good result is possible.
But what about Red Bull? That must be the biggest surprise and disappointment. Max complained about unpredictability of the car's behaviour all weekend. Not enough grip and not enough power... so still a lot of work to do for Honda. But the car is not super either. It's often said that Adrian Newey is the best designer but his last championship winning car is from seven years ago. The best designers are with Mercedes.
And a great qualy for Williams! Finally not dead last with some genuine speed.
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Post by robmarsh on Jul 18, 2020 18:11:28 GMT
Yep, apart from the Mercs, a really interesting qualifying. I feel for Alex Albon though. I think he is fighting for his seat and things are just not going his way. Marko is ruthless and the spectre of Seb hanging over his drive must be very unsettling despite what CH says.
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Post by charleselan on Jul 18, 2020 18:28:16 GMT
MB teams A & B to the fore; can't get my head around Stroll's performance even if Perez felt a little groggy. Maybe one can become a half decent F1 racer with lots of money and coaching . Brilliant performance by George Russell, that lad needs to be in a Merc ..........Now! Also what a great post qualification interview with the lad where his support for his friend and compatriot Alexander Albon was outstanding, basically saying that the Fizzy Drinks Team were making him look an idiot and that Alexander certainly wasn't an idiot. Those three British lad really are a different breed to what we have had to put up with over the past 20 years, I say that not out a nationalistic intent but merely human. Just taking up René's point about Adrian Newey; I do think that he has been hampered over that period by not having very good engines in his cars, but yes the MB organisation really have had an outstanding design and technology team over this formula. Possibly had Ferrari managed to keep James Allison their fortunes may have been somewhat better, but they do look a bit stronger this weekend. I bet Sebastian fancies his chances in one of those Pink MB's.
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Post by René on Jul 19, 2020 10:28:56 GMT
Just taking up René's point about Adrian Newey; I do think that he has been hampered over that period by not having very good engines in his cars, but yes the MB organisation really have had an outstanding design and technology team over this formula. My point about Newey may be somewhat exaggerated but not entirely untrue I think. He is still a brilliant designer of course and you're right about Red Bull not having the best engines which doesn't help. But he has not hit the sweet spot with his designs from the word go for quite a while now. In other words, Red Bull have been on the backfoot at the start of a season for years now. They always manage to develop the car into winning machinery over the course of a season but to win a championship you need a strong car from the start. They (Red Bull/Newey) somehow have failed to do that for years. On the other hand, trying to beat a Mercedes team that has a stranglehold on the sport since the introduction of the hybrid PU's is not an easy task. Mercedes's spending and engineering force is unprecedented.
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Post by mikael on Jul 19, 2020 10:34:26 GMT
Interesting that almost three seconds have been gained on this twisty track since the introduction of the present formula/format in 2017: 2017 pole position time: 1:16.276 (Vettel, Ferrari) 2020 pole position time: 1:13.447 (Hamilton, MB)
Latest V8-powered PP (2013): 1:19.388 (Hamilton, MB) Latest V10-powered PP (2005): 1:19.882 (M. Schumacher, Ferrari)
Latest of the previous turbo era PP (1988): 1:27.635 (A. Senna, McLaren-Honda)
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Post by René on Jul 19, 2020 16:46:17 GMT
Despite my critical comments on Red Bull in my previous post I was very impressed with them this afternoon!
A silly mistake by Max (remember Prost in Imola 1990 or or was it 91?) which seemed to put him out of the race but then the magic from the mechanics and a strong race to second was all very impressive. Hats off!
Lewis will be champion again and have all the records to his name by end season.
Ferrari.... ah well.... I am glad it's a relatively short season.
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