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Post by Carl on Jul 25, 2022 4:01:58 GMT
I stopped paying attention shortly after Charles Leclerc hit the wall. At first he was yelling about the same sticking throttle problem, then later admitted he was trying too hard. Whatever caused his accident, he's clearly under intense pressure and I wonder if he was pressed by Ferrari to take the blame. One commentator thought his rear wheels were turning too fast when he would have been hard on the brakes as he approached the tyre barrier.
After his accident, I decided the race was predictable and fast forwarded to the end for a simple reason: no matter how important the occasion or how grand the prix, without the leavening effect of Martin Brundle I'd rather not listen to the trio of idiots SkyTV has mistaken for announcers.
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Post by mikael on Jul 25, 2022 8:48:28 GMT
In whatever way, Leclerc's spin was a demonstration that the cars are back to the level where Niki Lauda wanted them to be: with wide tyres, where the grip characteristics is like "falling off from a cliff" at the limit of adhesion.
Fascinating, actually, that it can catch out even the very best.
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Post by René on Jul 25, 2022 10:44:26 GMT
A difficult one to digest but it also raises the question: "are Ferrari and Charles ready for a championship?" Don’t get me wrong, I will always stand behind the team and I believe Charles will be a multiple champion. But maybe this year is too early? Ferrari build a fantastic car. It’s the outright fastest car on the grid and they did it with a unique concept no-one else has and they even managed to make it the prettiest car of them all! A true Ferrari.  But it’s fragile. 7 poles and only 3 wins (for Leclerc) to show for simply isn’t good enough. Not championship level. This is the 3rd retirement while leading the race, two because of an engine failure and this one because of a driver error (it was an error). Add in the Monaco fiasco and that’s 4 wins down the drain. Charles is magnificent as he showed with that brilliant win in Austria. But he made a mistake in Imola and now this one in France. To win the championship against a now more experienced and super confident Verstappen and a smooth operating Red Bull team, you cannot afford those mistakes. And neither can the team. The indecisiveness at the pit wall is cringing at times. Monaco, Silverstone, yesterday with Carlos. It’s a fantastic season so far with extreme highs and extreme lows but just right now, I feel both Charles and Ferrari are not ready yet. It’s a shame because you got to strike while the iron's hot. And the F1-75 certainly is hot. And there’s no guarentee next year’s car will be as competitive. And Mercedes will most likely be in the game again… 63 points to make up to is a huge challenge. Not impossible but very difficult. The Red Bull is reliable by now and Max makes hardly any mistakes so he will end up on the podium at any race if he has no issues.
Winning is all Ferrari can do. Forza Ferrari.
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Post by charleselan on Jul 25, 2022 15:35:16 GMT
Not the end result the many including myself wanted, and place a bit of a downer on the Sunday. Charles is very honest and open and far too much down on himself which came out strong guy in his admission of his own error. I have a feeling that was manifestly increased by his frustration and annoyance as he cannot engaging reverse to enable him to get the lightly damaged Ferrari out of the barrier, the sounds over the radio very clearly illustrated that fact.
At the time of the accident i had some thoughts which were supported by Nico Rosberg after the race in his analysis. Contrary to the other Sly people (idiots if you will) said in his opinion Charles admitted guilt too quickly and should have kept his council before analysing all the available data. Nico mentioned that he could see no sign of an error and felt that the accident could have been attributed the wind gusts which are common at Ricard, they also change direction at will constantly. As Charles entered the corner for the majority of the time the wind may have been a the front of the cart or none at all and then on the occasion of the crash it could have been behind the car and accounted for anything like 20% of the cars downforce, no driver could have countered that loss.
This was also supported by Ant Davidson's "SkyPad" presentation where he shows in-car footage of Charles in the corner and the accident. He illustrated all of the important issues like turn in point and apex and then showed identical coverage of the previous lap and it was identical, he was lost for an explanation!
I will also say that i was extremely unimpressed by the team manager Binotto's post race interview where he was asked if it was mechanical failure and he said it wasn't but a "driver error". That is very bad management you do not throw you driver (employee) under the bus, if it had been Horner the answer would have been "I cannot give an answer until we have studied all the data to find out what happened". Don't like Horner but that is the way to manage people correctly.
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Post by Carl on Jul 25, 2022 16:30:40 GMT
Wasn't Leclerc due to come in that lap? If so, it's possible he wanted as fast an in-lap as possible.
Mattia Binotto placing the blame before more thorough analysis may suggest that pressure from Maranello is intense for everyone.
Whatever the cause, it's just a damn shame that Charles Leclerc lost what should have been a great win. Had the accident not occurred, all else would have played out differently. Had Charles stayed in front, Verstappen may have made a mistake and lost all points.
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Post by Carl on Jul 25, 2022 16:41:45 GMT
...my growing list of personal grouses... Haha, love it.  But yeah, here you go. My first thoughts... (1) Porpoising and ground clearance. (2) Grid penalties. (3) FIA authoritarianism re jewellery and forced compliance of attending meetings. (4) Track limits and track design. (5) Dropping traditional and great circuits. (1) Don't like the interference by the FIA, certainly not mid season. Their role is to make sure everyone acts within the regulations. Teams will sort out the porpoising themselves. (2) The grid penalty rule is flawed. The fact Carlos is penalized for getting a new engine is ridiculous. He already lost out by the engine failure so why penalize him again? If you want a penalty system, then penalize the team by reduction of constructors points or something. Not the driver. (3) Almost too ridiculous to go into. Have they nothing better to do?
(4) Extremely annoying. If you want a track limit in a certain corner, then make a track limit. A wall or grass or gravel. All the drivers agree on that. Stop the endless run-offs and ridiculous paint jobs that apparently go with it. (5) The idea of dropping Monaco or Spa should not even exist. I understand it's a commercial sport but it's like dropping Wimbledon from the tennis calendar. Tradition does matter a lot in a sport like Formula 1.
Enjoy the race guys!  I agree with every complaint and would add the mandatory weighing of drivers. Does someone at the automotive federation have a body mass fetish? Will driver swimsuit competitions be next? |
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Post by René on Jul 25, 2022 16:51:42 GMT
This video analysis is interesting, even if there is no real 'proof' of what happened but it shows the way Charles negotiated the corner was not identical to the previous lap. It's a damn shame as he would have won this race.
Peter Windsor's report is very interesting as usual.
I agree Binotto's response wasn't the best way to react. In general I like Mattia and think he's doing a much better job than his recent predecessors but this wasn't his best moment. |
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Post by charleselan on Jul 25, 2022 17:50:50 GMT
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Post by Carl on Jul 25, 2022 18:43:51 GMT
This is Ant Davidson's analysis on the SkyPad, it might only be variable to UK viewers sadly or if you have a VPN. Not available, but I don't associate Anthony Davidson with the trio of fools. His analyses are always well done.
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Post by chrisb on Jul 26, 2022 8:05:18 GMT
Rene, I too like this new Ferrari boss especially after some of his predecessors and wonder if this is their policy about let MB and RB play the political game we'll play how it is or rather how we see it
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Post by charleselan on Jul 26, 2022 11:08:07 GMT
...my growing list of personal grouses... Haha, love it. But yeah, here you go. My first thoughts... (1) Porpoising and ground clearance. (2) Grid penalties. (3) FIA authoritarianism re jewellery and forced compliance of attending meetings. (4) Track limits and track design. (5) Dropping traditional and great circuits. (1) Don't like the interference by the FIA, certainly not mid season. Their role is to make sure everyone acts within the regulations. Teams will sort out the porpoising themselves. (2) The grid penalty rule is flawed. The fact Carlos is penalized for getting a new engine is ridiculous. He already lost out by the engine failure so why penalize him again? If you want a penalty system, then penalize the team by reduction of constructors points or something. Not the driver. (3) Almost too ridiculous to go into. Have they nothing better to do?
(4) Extremely annoying. If you want a track limit in a certain corner, then make a track limit. A wall or grass or gravel. All the drivers agree on that. Stop the endless run-offs and ridiculous paint jobs that apparently go with it. (5) The idea of dropping Monaco or Spa should not even exist. I understand it's a commercial sport but it's like dropping Wimbledon from the tennis calendar. Tradition does matter a lot in a sport like Formula 1.
Enjoy the race guys! Goodness anyone would have thought you were reading my thoughts! You could have made more of the FIA and authority though, really angered me about the suspended fine to Sebastian walking out of the drivers meeting. Can just imagine those idiots trying that with Ayrton, his response would have been you try that and i will quit and drive in IndyCar, they would have poo'd themselves. |
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Post by charleselan on Jul 26, 2022 11:22:01 GMT
Another point to consider is the fact that these current cars are notoriously difficult to prevent spinning and drivers unable to stop it no matter that they are the best in the world. I believe it was the same in the original ground effect era and drivers were not happy as they span so fast they could not collect them. One of the reasons is that they loose downforce so quickly through many interferences and the loss of grip is instantaneous and impossible to manage. This along with other vagaries of GF that the ever so clever technical minds of Brawn and Symonds did not factor in.
Pauli Dee mentioned on S*KF, that he also blamed the size and weight of the cars for the spinning phenomena. Yet another criticism of the size of these blasted cars.
Incidentally going back to Brawn & Symonds not paying attention to why GF was originally banned. First of porpoising which was a real issue and directly because of that the cars had to run so close to the ground which in itself meant the cars had little or no suspension movement. This became a huge safety issue to the drivers health with many fearing later spinal and paralysis injuries. The only suspension those cars had was in the tall 13" & 15" tyre wall deflect something not given today withe the rubber band tyre and 18" boy racer wheels. Also there were fears of escalating g forces being brought about in corners creating the matter of drivers blacking out.
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Post by René on Jul 26, 2022 18:48:01 GMT
No matter what happened to Charles and the huge disappointment, it’s important to stay positive and believe everything is still possible! Mattia Binotto: “There is no reason why not to win 10 races from now to the end.” That’s the spirit!  |
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Post by charleselan on Jul 27, 2022 10:44:39 GMT
No matter what happened to Charles and the huge disappointment, it’s important to stay positive and believe everything is still possible! Mattia Binotto: “There is no reason why not to win 10 races from now to the end.” That’s the spirit! As my mum used to quote of the old Doris Day song "What will be, will be". Wasn't disapproving of Binotto as I like the chap, but more a criticism of bad/poor team management, and not the first time either. He is a brilliant Technical Director but maybe team management is a step too far. |
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Post by René on Jul 27, 2022 18:27:52 GMT
No matter what happened to Charles and the huge disappointment, it’s important to stay positive and believe everything is still possible! Mattia Binotto: “There is no reason why not to win 10 races from now to the end.” That’s the spirit! As my mum used to quote of the old Doris Day song "What will be, will be". Wasn't disapproving of Binotto as I like the chap, but more a criticism of bad/poor team management, and not the first time either. He is a brilliant Technical Director but maybe team management is a step too far. Your mum was right of course (mums usually are.. ).
I agree re. Binotto. A brilliant technical brain but maybe not always nuanced and/or tactical enough as team manager. But he's growing in his role and I have the feeling he's honest.
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But yeah, here you go. My first thoughts...
